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Subtle mones?
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Rattlesnake
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Subtle mones?
12-09-2009 7:38 AM

Just like to hear peoples (men and women) thoughts on the subtle mone effects. Maybe I've been spoiled by the hard hitting pherobombs out there that I just don't appreciate the softly softly approach. In terms of subtle (read next to non-existent) effects Chikara tops the bill. I usually have to drench myself with the stuff to get a response, which is usually a little more friendliness.

Ammo, I have to say is pretty much in the same boat, although the effects are a little more noticeable, for me it's clearly a social mone product, although far superior to Chikara in that regard.

So, what I guess I'm asking is, do you guys use mones for their subtle effects and in what environments? I can see where they are useful (social steering) but I get the feeling I may have outgrown them in that regard. What I mean by that is socially I'm far more confident (with a little help from the old mones) so perhaps I feel I don't need them anymore for that purpose. Anyone else had similar experiences?
12-09-2009 7:38 AM
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Phya
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-16-2009 11:56 PM

I think I see what you mean. I think 'subtle' effects are a product of dosage and carrier, rather than the pheromone itself. I would say that all of the oil products I have tried are more on the 'subtle' side. The effects usually show themselves a couple minutes into the interaction, and are almost always more smooth and subtle. I get less of the neck breaking hits that I usually get with alcohol based products.

I'm not sure what you mean with the last paragraph, maybe you could elaborate? Are you saying you don't need as strong of a dose as before to achieve to same results?

"Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life. Don't be trapped by dogma... which is living with the results of other people's thinking. Don't let the noise of others' opinions drown out your own inner voice. And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary."
-Steve Jobs
12-16-2009 11:56 PM
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Rattlesnake
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-19-2009 3:56 PM

(12-16-2009 11:56 PM)Phya Wrote:  I think I see what you mean. I think 'subtle' effects are a product of dosage and carrier, rather than the pheromone itself. I would say that all of the oil products I have tried are more on the 'subtle' side. The effects usually show themselves a couple minutes into the interaction, and are almost always more smooth and subtle. I get less of the neck breaking hits that I usually get with alcohol based products. 


Hi Phya, I agree with you to the extent the alcohol based products hit hard and fast, whilst oil based are slightly more subtle (and longer lasting). But what I meant by my opening post is the subtleness in the sense of the vibe you give off.

To explain a little better, lets take a social mone, for example Instant Shine. The effects are that (if you take it to the extreme), you can become the centre of attention and with a little charisma the life of the party. The effects can be obvious in the change in mood of others and their reaction towards you. Now, if you consider Chikara7/Ammo, for me at least, the only effect I get is that I'm considered more friendlier allowing you to socialise easier with others but you won't get the centre of attention effect. 

Another way to look at it, A314, gives me an aura of authority. Now lets say we have a second fictitious subtle product for business called Mr. X. With Mr. X you still obtain the some respect but whilst people listen you lead from the back (so to speak), you can influence without it being obvious and without the same behavioral/body language displays of respect. Hopefully this clarifies things a littel, I'm trying to convey an idea which seems to make sense in my head but is hard has hell to convert into words.

Anyhow, it's quite an interesting subject for me, and the more I think about it, subtle manipulations (not quite the right word) can be quite useful. Although, whether or not you need mones for it is another matter. Kind of using NLP to subtly influence.

12-19-2009 3:56 PM
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Phya
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-19-2009 9:01 PM

I think I understand what you're trying to say now. You're saying you're looking for effects that are more in the background, drawing less attention to the wearer, but still having an effect on those around you?

I'd say that if you're looking for something like that, I would play with dosages and different application spots. Applying pheromones to the top of your head might disperse the pheromones more widely and evenly, resulting in a dispersion of the vibe, rather than focusing attention on to you. Your own behavior might also play a role -- how you choose to act on the vibes you're sending out. I could see A314 focusing attention onto you, but I could also see it in a background role, depending on how you behave. If you step out and take command (the usual behavior w/ A314), then you'll be the focus. But if you take a step back and let others lead, you can still jump in every now and then and put in your two cents. I'd say it's how you use it.

If you had dispersion units around the room you're in, it might lead to the effects you're looking for. Am I getting what you're saying now?

"Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life. Don't be trapped by dogma... which is living with the results of other people's thinking. Don't let the noise of others' opinions drown out your own inner voice. And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary."
-Steve Jobs
12-19-2009 9:01 PM
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renny
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-21-2009 12:28 PM

(12-09-2009 7:38 AM)Rattlesnake Wrote:  So, what I guess I'm asking is, do you guys use mones for their subtle effects and in what environments? I can see where they are useful (social steering) but I get the feeling I may have outgrown them in that regard. What I mean by that is socially I'm far more confident (with a little help from the old mones) so perhaps I feel I don't need them anymore for that purpose. Anyone else had similar experiences?


I get what you are asking here. I feel very much the same way, I've reached a point where I feel like using pheromones on a regular basis is just too much. I am every so grateful for the paths they have opened in my life but they can punch too hard sometimes.

I gotta admit that I'm just not using them very often. Where I do use them is for special occasions. Family get togethers, meeting new groups of people, traveling, special dates, all these things benefit from a dose of mones. It's nice to know that they are in my tool kit.

To get subtle effects you have to keep the dose so low that it maybe doesn't make that much of a difference. One may be better served by speaking slightly louder and more clearly than by wearing a small amount of A314. By the same token, on occasions when a pherobomb is called for, there is no need for being subtle...just drop the bomb and ride the ride!


The Androstenone Discussion
12-21-2009 12:28 PM
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Rattlesnake
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-28-2009 10:23 AM

Hi guys, thanks for the replies, we are getting closer! P

To rephrase, I'm talking about mone products that are inherently subtle despite their dosage and application. Whilst dosage has a direct influence on the effects, there are some products that no matter how much you splash on you'll never get a hard hitting effect, well except maybe paralyzing your ability to smell.
12-28-2009 10:23 AM
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Phya
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-28-2009 5:03 PM

Heh, okay I get what you're asking. I don't know too many. I do feel like p83 is very under the radar, but it has strong effects, it's just that no one ever notices it.

A1 is also somewhat subtle. I can never place how it effects women, but I know it does. But again, it has a strong effect, just not visually noticeable.

p74 is more on the subtle side I suppose.

Anyone else?

"Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life. Don't be trapped by dogma... which is living with the results of other people's thinking. Don't let the noise of others' opinions drown out your own inner voice. And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary."
-Steve Jobs
12-28-2009 5:03 PM
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Gegogi
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-28-2009 7:19 PM

Mones are highly context sensitive and reactions are all over the place depending on whom wears them and where. I have a pretty mellow persona outside of work and most mones--even hardcore doses of androstenone--are subtle when I wear them. Of course if I lay down a good acting routine they scale up quickly. The one lone exception is A1. It heals down PMS stricken women like gangbusters. However, beyond that its effects remain subtle even if I do handstands and sing yankee doodle.

Ah don't wanna pickle...just wanna ride mah motosickle! Twisted
12-28-2009 7:19 PM
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renny
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RE: Subtle mones?
12-30-2009 8:48 AM

P74, Methoxyestratetraenone , TAC, TAK, all of these have been subtle I guess. I've never seen them make those dramatic turn the room from mad to glad or vice versa. They do have effects but they are hard to pin down.

The Androstenone Discussion
12-30-2009 8:48 AM
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Tisha
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RE: Subtle mones?
01-04-2010 9:23 AM

This is a excellent question.

When I first started using pheromones almost 10 years ago I started with a product called Pure instinct. I had gone to a naughty nightie party my friend was giving. Those are like Tupperware parties but they sell nighties and stuff. The lady had samples there and we all tried it and loved it.

I used that for a while before I delved deeper into the pheromone world. It was subtle and I noticed I felt good wearing it and people seemed to talk more. I believe its just Alpha Androstenol. I used various other products from here and there, some worked some didnt, but I didnt start really using the hard hitters till I joined androtics. There a whole new world in pheromones enhancement opened up for me. You get sort of sucked into the whole thing at that point. So much to choose from so many emotions to explore and such strong noticeable hits compared to those more subtle products.

I think after a while you get burned out. I find now after having a lot of experience with the hard hitting mones. I can see effects from those more subtle products easier then I did before but that dosent mean the hits come easier. I am just more aware. This I feel is because I evolved as a user and as a person not because the product works better.

I like going back and using those more subtle products like pure instinct, cleo, realm for her. But I think Pheromax is my favorite. Lure is not bad either although the scent leaves something to be desired. I can take a bath in these with no increase in effect.

They give soft subtle effects that are great for everyday enhancement.

I would never suggest a soft subtle mone product for someone who is just started and is skeptical. They need to get past that threshold between uncertainty and being sure that yes something is occurring here.


Quote:Heh, okay I get what you're asking. I don't know too many. I do feel like p83 is very under the radar, but it has strong effects, it's just that no one ever notices it.

Single molecule putatives are subtle by nature. They can be harder to pick up on by themselves and its true many people dont notice it.


For instance take P83 since we already mentioned that one. It definitely does something but what ? People are definitely paying more attention to me. They seem to be behaving differently, but how. By journaling in detail about your observations you end up seeing distinct patterns that you can not just pick out from memory. Repeated behaviors and repeated descriptive words that keep popping up in your notes.

I think a lot of long time users including myself think "hell I have experience, I dont need to take notes, I know what I am doing" But we do need to go back to basics sometimes.

But I think rattlesnakes question is a bit deeper then that.



Quote:Hopefully this clarifies things a littel, I'm trying to convey an idea which seems to make sense in my head but is hard has hell to convert into words.

I think I understand though it is hard to put into words. Two formulas both designed to do the same thing but one creates a more subtle feeling or hit while the other creates the harder hitting noticeable hit. I think for the experienced user, one who is no longer skeptical and has evolved socially from the use of pheromones and other methods need to go more subtle to produce growth. What I mean is when we all start out, its usually with a specific purpose and are looking for a quick fix. But as we get more into using mones it brings our attention to all aspects of socialization and we naturally improve in confidence and interaction with others. We also get better at reading people. Because we have evolved more socially we feel we have outgrown some mixes to some extent. Even if its a hard hitting mix we have evolved and in doing so we dont need the hard hitting ones as much. They dont fit our needs or inspire us to grow.

What I like about going back to the more subtle mixes is that you have to work for it more and in doing so you grow naturally more. If you look at pheromones as a tool, eventually as we grow in any skill we no longer need certain tools to get the job done. More advanced or sophisticated tools may make reaching your goal more easy but those tools wont promote growth they just make it easier. I think part of the reason I like going back to using some of the more subtle products (other then what I mentioned already) is that you have to work for it more so they help you grow as a person more which ultimately is the whole reason we are on this earth.

Tisha
01-04-2010 9:23 AM
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