(10-29-2011 4:09 AM)Rattlesnake Wrote:  Ok, so now what? You've already been told the molecule in that report is not the androstanone in mones but something else...Aside from saying Androtics secretly put it in what is now the purpose of this thread? Are you simply going to reiterate everything that has already been over and over and over again? For what purpose?

There's some other people arent as good at understanding things as you and need a little more guidance. If they question me, I will respond with facts.

I'm not sure how significant this is, but I find the chemical name extremely interesting

https://www.chemicalbook.com/ChemicalPro...942263.htm

(10-29-2011 4:59 AM)Ultimate Wrote:  I'm not sure how significant this is, but I find the chemical name extremely interesting

https://www.chemicalbook.com/ChemicalPro...942263.htm

How and why, what do you find such interesting?

You know that Dihydrotestosterone aka 17-ß-hydroxyandrostanone is the main male androgene?? You know that the amounts in your cells will be caused by you endogene?

(10-29-2011 4:20 AM)Ultimate Wrote:  There's some other people arent as good at understanding things as you and need a little more guidance. If they question me, I will respond with facts.

Ultimate, I've now stepped in twice and asked you guys to stop bickering. And, the tone of the thread had died down to a somewhat polite discussion, although pretty much everybody now feels that you are wrong, the thread has been far more pleasant than it started out and the name calling stopped.

Responding to another member with the "some of you are a little slow" comment was uncalled for, insulting and an invitation for the attacks to start again.

If it happens again you will receive a warning, and if it continues after that you will be banned.

Rattlesnake, thank you for not counterattacking him.

This thread has now gone on far longer than it should have: nodobody is going to convince anybody of anything, and it this point your all beating on dead horses.

For any of you that still think this discussion is worth continuing, please PM me your address and I'll send you a rock, and you can argue with it forever.

(10-29-2011 8:55 AM)mark-in-dallas Wrote:  Ultimate, I've now stepped in twice and asked you guys to stop bickering. And, the tone of the thread had died down to a somewhat polite discussion, although pretty much everybody know feels that you are wrong, the thread has been far more pleasant than it started out and the name calling stopped.

Responding to another member with the "some of you are a little slow" allegation was uncalled for, insulting and an invitation for the attacks to start again.

If it happens again you will receive a warning, and if it continues after that you will be banned.

Rattlesnake, thank you for not counterattacking him.

This thread has now gone on far longer than it should have: nodobody is going to convince anybody of anything, and it this point your all beating on dead horse.

For any of you that still think this discussion is worth continuing, please PM me your address and I'll send you a rock, and you can argue with it forever.

sorry couldn't help it

I fail to grasp what it is that you are trying to achieve. If you are convinced that your facts are right then maybe just try and get this resolved with your doctors or whatever the case may be.

At first I thought you were here to seek sympathy, advice, recommendations, or possibly a warning to everyone here, but it now seems you just want to lash out to those that are enjoying the benefits of using mones.

I agree it may be have gotten to the point where it is necessary to end this thread.

Sounds like your condition has caused you a lot of pain.

You should look into chelation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chelation_therapy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chelation

It also may be called EDTA therapy.

I'm not sure if you have doctors who practice this therapy in your country or not. We have them in the US. I use one in Dallas very near the airport. You could fly in and take a treatment. You would know right away if the therapy works for you or not.

PM me if you want the contact info for this Doctor.

A better bet would be to consult an oncologist.

(10-29-2011 12:05 PM)dbot Wrote:  A better bet would be to consult an oncologist.

Or a street psychologist

J/k

Or better yet, a psychiatrist... ultimate is likely to be mentally ill: see below for a spot-on match of his symptoms... Panic disorder? Check.. Somatoform disorder? Check... Migraines? Check...

Can all of these be treated? Yes, with medication

Are pheromones the cause of his Illness? no! (read on)


MCS = multiple chemical sensitivity


Misdiagnosis

More than half of 56 people from one study about MCS instead had somatoform disorder[29] or panic disorder.[30] Other possible explanations include migraine, anxiety disorder, lupus, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome or other forms of orthostatic intolerance, hay fever and other allergies, hypercalcemia, hypothyroidism, chronic fatigue syndrome, or fibromyalgia. Sufferers may also have a tendency to "catastrophically misinterpret benign physical symptoms"[31] or simply a disturbingly acute sense of smell.[32]

Psychological

Several mechanisms for psychological etiology have been proposed, including theories based on stress, Pavlovian conditioning, or misdiagnoses of an underlying mental illness. Behavior exhibited by MCS sufferers may reflect broader sociological fears about industrial pollution.[33]

The distinction between physiological and psychological causes is often difficult to test,[3] and it is particularly challenging for MCS because substances used to test for sensitivity can often be detected by scent. Odor cues make double blind studies of MCS patients difficult, and scents might provoke a psychosomatic response.

Research by Dr Mariko Saito et al. from the Department of Psychosomatic Medicine at the University of Tokyo in 2005 found patients only experienced symptoms when they themselves initiated the challenge tests. When they were given random prompts, there was no difference between MCS patients and controls in terms of physical and psychologic symptoms.[34] Their conclusion was "MCS patients do not have either somatic or psychologic symptoms under chemical-free conditions, and symptoms may be provoked only when exposed to chemicals," although their results showed it was not the chemicals themselves that caused the symptoms.

A review of 37 provocation studies concluded "persons with MCS do react to chemical challenges; however, these responses occur when they can discern differences between active and sham substances, suggesting that the mechanism of action is not specific to the chemical itself and might be related to expectations and prior beliefs".[3]

The cause and existence of MCS are disputed. In particular, doctors disagree about whether symptoms are physiologically or psychologically generated, or both. United States courts and several medical organizations reject MCS as a physiological disease. An approach called clinical ecology attempts to treat the disease, but this work is controversial.[36] Critics charge:

MCS has never been clearly defined,

no scientifically plausible mechanism has been proposed for it,

no diagnostic tests have been substantiated,[37] and

not a single case has been scientifically validated.[38]